The Beljanski Cancer Talk Show
Welcome to "The Beljanski Cancer Talk Show," a podcast series dedicated to exploring comprehensive and integrative approaches to cancer treatment and chronic diseases.
Our journey delves into the world of holistic health, examining how it complements traditional medicine in the fight against cancer.
In each episode, we'll be discussing various aspects of holistic care, including nutrition, mental health, alternative therapies, and lifestyle changes, with a focus on how these elements collectively support the body, mind, and spirit during cancer treatment and beyond. We will feature expert guests - oncologists, naturopaths, nutritionists, psychologists, and survivors, all sharing their insights and experiences.
Whether you're a patient, a caregiver, or someone interested in holistic health, this series offers valuable perspectives and practical advice to empower and inspire you on your journey.
The Beljanski Cancer Talk Show
Episode 21 - The 7 Key Principles of Cancer Therapy Emotions and Cancer with Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND
In this episode, we dive into the transformative journey of Dr. Antonio Tony Jimenez, founder of Hope4Cancer Treatment Centers, as he shares how his personal experiences and professional evolution led him to embrace integrative oncology.
His path from conventional medicine to a holistic approach was deeply influenced by his father’s battle with prostate cancer—a pivotal moment that reshaped his understanding of healing. Dr. Antonio Jimenez reveals how his centers focus on a principle-based method that goes beyond traditional treatments, prioritizing the mind-body connection, emotional health, and the power of nutrition.
With a deep commitment to improving the quality of life for his patients, he discusses the remarkable success rates and how these practices are revolutionizing cancer care. Tune in to discover how integrative oncology is not just treating cancer, but changing lives.
Episode Highlights:
🔬 The Journey to Integrative Oncology
🌿 Integrative Medicine vs. Conventional Medicine
💥 The Healing Power of Atmosphere and Mindset
🧘♀️ The Emotional Connection to Cancer
🧠 Success Stories and Survival Rates
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Introduction and Dr. Tony's Background
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: So why do some patients with breast cancer, it metastasizes to the bone first? But others it metastasizes to the liver first, and others to the lung first? Why is that?
Victor Dwyer: Hey, everyone! Welcome to today's episode of The Beljanski Cancer Talk Show. Today's episode called “The Seven Key Principles of Cancer Therapy Emotions and Cancer” is super exciting. We're joined by Dr. Antonio Jimenez, Founder and Chief Medical Officer of the Hope4Cancer Treatment Centers, where he leads a team of over 200 employees, including over 25 MD physicians.
For more than 30 years, Dr. Tony has dedicated his life to the study, clinical research, and implementation of integrative strategies to treat cancer, chronic infections, and immune disorders. He is widely respected by his compassionate approach and innovative treatments which are grounded in his Seven Key Principles of Cancer Therapy.
He is also one of the only seven physicians worldwide certified to treat patients with the Gonzalez protocol. Please join me by welcoming Dr. Tony to the show.
Victor Dwyer: Dr. Tony, thank you so much for joining. I've heard a lot about you. Please tell the audience about who you are and how you got here.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Nice to be here and spreading the word of integrative oncology and that's what I do for the last 24 years. We have a treatment center called Hope4Cancer that started in Tijuana in the year 2000.
And in 2015, we opened our Cancun treatment center where we have the pleasure and honor of Sylvie being with us. And she actually gave a talk, a lecture to our doctors. It was beautiful.
And so this is my life, my passion, my mission, because my dad was diagnosed with prostate cancer in his early sixties. And he didn't tell me initially. And then he started conventional therapy that didn't go well for him. It was just one or two treatments. And he called me, said, “Son, I was just diagnosed with cancer. I did this and that. And I can't do that anymore.”
The Journey to Integrative Oncology
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: And I switched my career from surgery to trying to help my dad.
And what a blessing because my dad was eventually cured. He lived to be 83 and died of heart disease, nothing to do with the stage three prostate cancer that he was diagnosed. So, I have many stories but, in essence, it is a mission and Hope4Cancer Treatment Center is now serving patients from over 40 countries, all ages.
And we're seeing a lot of younger patients now, more aggressive cancers, patients that were in remission coming out of remission. So, now is the time to be educated, to be proactive. And everything you learn on these podcasts with The Beljanski Foundation, please take it to heart. Be proactive, and start today, not mañana, not tomorrow.
Sylvie Beljanski: But you make it sound like easy. There was your dad's phone call and then you switched. But as a doctor, it was going to go, taking you to a completely different pathway than what you had been trained for as a conventional doctor.
Integrative Medicine vs. Conventional Medicine
Sylvie Beljanski: So how different, what does it mean to become an integrative doctor?
What are the difference between the therapies used by your conventional doctor and an integrative doctor? How did you have to retrain and open your mind and learn new things and apply that to your patients?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes, exactly. Because for example, in nutrition, nutrition being one of the Seven Key Principles to my foundational therapies that I talk about in my book.
But what did we learn about nutrition in medical school? Nothing. And I found mentors. I was blessed to travel the world, literally. I got invited by colleagues and friends from other countries. And it was many years, many journeys, many patients and forming that network of older, wiser than me, at the time, colleagues who have a lot of experience and knowing that medicine, of course, is never static, right?
So, we're always learning, but it did take, as you say, Sylvie, that change in mindset. And for me, it was wanting to help my father, of course, and then wanting to help who is now my daughter. That's how I met my wife. Her daughter at the age of six years old was diagnosed with leukemia in Chicago in the U.S.
And the mom was told that with a bone marrow transplant, chemotherapy, her daughter had a 50-50 chance of survival. And if she survived, a hundred percent chance that she wouldn't be able to have children. And then her mom, Marcy, found me in Tijuana. I just had opened my clinic. I'm like, “Yeah, what can I do in integrative oncology?”
And so, Whitney is now 29 years old and she has four children. Beautiful, healthy girl, healthy children. And it did take that paradigm shift. But then I realized, even as an, as an intern, when I was an intern I saw that the patients had at least ten medications. One medication to mitigate the symptoms of the first medication.
And I was blessed. You know how God has a plan for us, because in the hospital where I did my internship after the four years of medical school, they had a wing which was integrative medicine. And I saw that patients in that floor looked better, they were happier, and they were doing other things in combination with the conventional therapies—be it chemotherapy or radiation, but they were always doing other things.
They were worried about the immune, attending to the immune system, attending to detoxification and so forth. So, I looked at this floor and then I looked at the floor of only conventional medicine and these patients had no hair, they're vomiting, they're in bed, weak, and the other integrated floor, they oftentimes didn't even look like cancer patients.
So, yeah, there were many aspects of my career and this transformation, as you say, Sylvie, that really impacted me and for sure made, allowed me to make that decision to go into integrative oncology.
The Healing Power of Atmosphere and Mindset
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, you are mentioning, the difference of atmosphere between the two, two, the way the patients are living through therapy when in a, in conventional setting and in integrative setting. And when I visited your, your clinic in Cancun had the pleasure to go to new Hope, Hope4Cancer clinic in Cancun. And what really, I was struck by first the beautiful setting. The ocean view everywhere, the serene atmosphere.
And I was given a tour and I saw a room where there were several patients taking some infusion IV therapy. And generally, indeed, the atmosphere in this kind of rooms is pretty grim. It's a time where people reflect on their own mortality. And here they were all smiling.
They were all like taking a time for almost for meditation and felt good about their treatment, about their life. It felt, did not feel like a vacation, but it felt really good, really, really good. And and that I think that's a big part also of the healing journey to feel good about about your disease, the treatment and to, to make peace with with the disease and the rest of the life.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Absolutely, Sylvie and Victor. We start every morning at both of our treatment centers in Tijuana and Cancun, Mexico with we call it praise and worship prayer.
It's open to all spiritual beliefs, denominations. We are Christian-based, but it's open to all, of all faiths. And start the morning with prayer and worship. meditation and focusing. Imagine how that sets the tone for the rest of the day, right? We oftentimes do dancing classes and I remember an example.
There was a couple, the lady had very advanced cancer and in, in one of the activities, the patient started to dance and afterwards she was crying and we're like, what happened? She said, “This is the first time in my life that I have danced with my husband.” Can you believe that? At a cancer center, right?
And this was, it just, what it does for the mind and for the healing is unmeasurable.
The Emotional Connection to Cancer
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, and I know that you pay a lot of importance to the connection between the mind and actually the healing process, whether it is for immune disease or cancer. Can you tell us more about that?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes, so much so that my next book coming out in January of 2025 is called “Emotions and Cancer.”
So, the link between traumas and conflict, these are sudden, unexpected, traumatic, shock experiences that we are not ready for, nor do we have a solution to, at the time that they occur. And how does this down the line a year, 18 months, 5, 10, 20 years later, contribute and, oftentimes, are the main contributor to the onset of cancer.
So for example, a patient with breast cancer, is it the same to have breast cancer in the left breast versus the right breast? Or why is it? Why the left and not the right? Is it an accident? Is it what? But it has a very, it has a very clear biological reason because this is not psychology, this is biology.
And so the left side is related to the mother child, the niche, the nurse, the nest. The right side is more of the male side. And so we know that every patient with left breast cancer, which by the way is the most common, is related to mother-child, sexual abuse, bad relationship, ladies who have lost a child, maybe had an abortion, a miscarriage, or wanted to conceive a child, but never were able to.
So there's always a reason, a biological, emotional reason for the location of the cancer. And in the ancient times, in Greece and Egypt, when someone went to a health facility, let's say Hope4Cancer, the first person they saw was not Dr. Tony, it was the spiritual advisor, the monk, the rabbi, the priest, the minister, and then they saw the emotional counselor, the mental, emotional counselor.
And then at the end they saw the medical doctor. We were like at the end of the hallway by the bathroom, right? So, they gave importance to the mind above all to the spiritual health, then the mental, emotional, and then the physical. And now in conventional medicine, talking a bit of your first question about integrative medicine, that's another big difference.
In integrative medicine, we focus on the holistic, right? The spiritual, emotional as well as the physical which, of course, conventional medicine does nothing about the emotional and spiritual. So yes, the emotional aspect of healing is very important. And I tell patients who don't believe it or, are hesitant about that is “Give it a chance. Give yourself the benefit of the doubt.”
And we have a program at Hope4Cancer called the BEST program. B-E-S-T, that stands for Behavioral, Emotional, and Spiritual Therapy. And I tell you that when they're out of those sessions with our practitioners, who actually are medical doctors, trained in this area of medicine and integrative oncology.
When the patients come out of those sessions, they are transformed. That's the word they use. It's transformed because now they see the connection. They see some of the underlying causes that contributed to the formation of that cancer in that location.
And guess what? Also, to where the metastasis happened. So, why do some patients with breast cancer, they, it metastasizes to the bone first, but others it metastasizes to the liver first, and others to the lung first. Why is that? Is that just random? No, we could go into the biological-emotional aspect. Is there fear? So fear is more the lung. Was there like, were they, had a near drowning experience? And so the lung will be the first target organ.
Do they have conflicts with getting to one location to another that they abandoned France and moved to the US? That could have been a trauma for them. So we looked at all this, and actually I have a story, but it's a long story about a patient from France who, when I, I'll make the story short.
She was in, during World War II and in France, and the Nazis came into her house and she was there with her, her father. And at that time, the father decided to leave willingly with the SS officers. And the little girl at this time, 10 years old, she stayed behind. She never saw her father again.
Eventually, she went to an orphanage and she made it to the U. S. She was about 10 years old at the time. Fast forward the story, when she was about 50, 60 years old, she developed right breast cancer. Remember the male side.
And what we found out is that since she was a little girl, she thought that the father didn't love her. He abandoned her because he didn't fight for her. She didn't see the father, try to fight. But then we had her realize that he loved her so much that he sacrificed his own life to save her.
And it gets a little more involved. We did a session, which we call the fireside chat. And in that session, Sylvie and Victor, she started talking in French and she hadn't spoken French since she left to the orphanage.
And so it's amazing how, when we go deep and we go to that area and guess what, miraculously or not, she was healed, cured from the cancer when she let go of the trauma.
Sylvie Beljanski: It's a clearing and there are now a lot of studies also showing that emotions start a cascade of very physical reactions, hormonal and so on, which then affect our body on a very physical and cellular level. So, all that is actually biologically all linked. It's it's frivolous to, to believe it, it is not. And we are no longer at the time where Dr. Hamer was actually sent to, to, to jail for it was one of the first one to say back, I think, in the forties that that there was a link between some specific type of emotions and some locations of cancer.
He left a very comprehensive study linking a number of emotions, a kind of grief and location of cancer. And he started an entire movement. And the conventional therapy doctor jailed him because, oh my God, how can you bring, emotion to the mix? That's, cancer business is going to escape us. That's what their approach. And in fact, it's completely ridiculous.
Success Stories and Survival Rates
Sylvie Beljanski: And the success, and really, I would like you to speak a little bit about the success rate that you have in your Hope4Cancer because this is so much better than what conventional doctors are able to boast.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes. Thank you for mentioning Dr. Hamer. I was blessed to spend some time with him in his home in Norway, when he left Germany, then he went to Spain, then to Norway, where he continued his work, and ultimately he passed away in Norway a few years ago. But I spent three hours with him in his home in Norway, with Dr. Hamer.
I also studied from a French fellow who continued Hamer's work, also Dr. Jean-Claude Sabat. I don't, my French is not that good, but Claude Sabat. And then another French guy in Montreal, Canada, Gilbert Renaud also a French Canadian guy.
So, the BEST program that I mentioned stems from the work of Dr. Hamer and through total biology, recall healing, and then I, myself, made some tweaks. So, it is a big part of our therapy.
And to your question, I'm trying to pull up here the statistics because it's interesting that our attorneys have told us not to publish our statistics because this is all in the face of the cancer world, all the A's, FDA, AMA, and all that, but we did a five-year survival data for several types of cancer. And I'll mention that, for example, for metastatic lung cancer, we have to take into account that 70 percent of the patients that come to Hope4Cancer are stage four, sometimes even stage five, and they typically have failed conventional medicine.
So, it's not really comparing apples to apples because the NCI data, National Cancer Institute data, is not including stage four patients, right? So, for example, in stage four metastatic lung cancer, our one year survival is 77. 8 percent. Let's say 78 percent. And the NCI survival is 28 percent.
So, let's jump now to five years. Our data is 35 percent. Five-year survival with stage four metastatic lung cancer and the NCI data is 5. 5%. So, we're talking 35 percent to 5. 5%. That's, and then in pancreatic cancer, I want to mention that because this is a huge difference as well. One-year survival with metastatic pancreatic cancer is 80%. versus 19.4 % for the NCI data. And, look at this, five-year survival for pancreatic cancer, for Hope4Cancer is just under 32 percent and NCI data is 3.5%.
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, absolutely.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Significant difference. And, in addition, quality of life, because we have, yeah, we have done quarterly quality of life studies as well where we took into account several quality of life parameters like functional, social, cognitive, and others.
And there was about an 84 percent improvement in quality of life from before the patient starts with us till three weeks, three months later. And then we also did longitudinal studies. A longitudinal study is where we look at the survival and, typically, gold standard longitudinal studies is three months, but we did a one-year longitudinal study and also the statistics were quite compelling.
Actually, I asked my research and education team headed by Dr. Chakravarty, who's, you know, those smart Indians that have more degrees than a thermometer, right? So I asked him Dr. Chakravarty, I, you need to check this again because this is, I know we're good, but this was like, wow.
So, he checked it again and his team checked it again and they say, “Yeah, Dr. Tony, this was correct” at the first time. So we constantly, Sylvie and Victor, we are doing analysis of how we could get better, what are results, we're always introducing new research and new therapies, so it's a labor of love and we're blessed to have a research and education team as well.
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, and the number of cancer keeps rising, but so is the number of immune disease patients. Are you able also to address people suffering from immune disease, and what is the relationship with cancer?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yeah, the interesting thing is that the foundational premise of treatment at Hope4Cancer is what I call the 7 Key Principles to Cancer Therapy that we were blessed to have published in 2012 at a peer-reviewed journal out of the University of California at Los Angeles, UCLA.
So, these Seven Key Principles form the foundation of our cancer treatment. But you're right, Sylvie, it's the foundation to, to treat any pathology because it does go back to, as Victor was talking before we started the podcast, let's keep it simple, and this is, this is exactly the Seven Key Principle applies to not only cancer patients, autoimmune disease patients, chronic disease patients, and guess what, which I want the podcast viewers to really listen to, is wellness and prevention, which is much easier than cure.
Yes, treating autoimmune, immune deficiencies are a part of what we do. I must say 90 percent of our patients are cancer patients but we have other patients that come for us for non-cancer diseases and also for wellness.
Nutrition and Cancer Prevention
Sylvie Beljanski: Very good. So, speaking of prevention and wellness in general, what are your key recommendations when it comes to nutrition?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes. When it comes to nutrition is, first of all, nutrition is one of the most overwhelming aspects of health for a patient because most of them, as we know, they're not following adequate, nutritional guidelines.
At our treatment centers, it's pretty easy because they're fed, they're given what they need to eat. But what happens when they go home? So, this is a very stressful situation. Chapter 6 in my book, Hope4Cancer, I, is about nutrition. And I list, I believe it's on page 170.
Sylvie Beljanski: Can you show us your book? Can you show us a cover of the book?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes, this is the book.
Sylvie Beljanski: Very good. So everybody sees the book.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yeah, Seven Key, “7 Principles To Remove Fear And Empower Your Healing Journey.” And now my goal is to write a book on each of the seven key principles. And as I said, the next one is emotions and cancer. And then after that, in end of 2025, will be nutrition and cancer. What we're talking about now.
So, here on page 170, I simply put “What are the food categories to avoid?” And let me read them to you quickly. One is foods that are cancer triggers. Those are like margarine, french fries, potatoes, those are foods that produce free radicals, generate free radicals, and so forth. So, cancer triggers.
Second is cancer promoters. Those are like refined sugar and flour products, soft drinks, and most dairy products. And then the third category is immune distractors. What are those foods that are distracting our immune system? And these could be foods like animal fats, animal proteins, sometimes, because they distract our immune system.
And then the fourth category are treatment antagonists, and some of you will not like this, but one of my treatment antagonist foods is coffee because it's a stimulant, and most patients, as we know, are in sympathetic dominant state, fight or flight.
I know that recently, I think you interviewed Mary Beth Gonzalez from the GonzaleZ Foundation and, or you will, and I'm a Gonzalez-certified practitioner as well.
And Dr. Gonzalez did a lot of work in sympathetic dominant cancers and parasympathetic dominant cancer. And 90 percent of all cancers are sympathetic dominant. That means that these patients are in flight or flight. Cortisol is high. So, coffee is a stimulant, and we don't recommend that, and of course, alcohol, any fluoride or fluoridated foods and water.
So, those are the four main categories, and what can patients do to, to work on their immune systems, on nutrition right away is keep it simple. Avoid gluten, avoid dairy, avoid processed and refined sugars, and avoid GMO, artificially-produced foods. Because, see, it's, there's a lot to be said about nutrition because there's the sugar-free cancer, the metabolic type diet.
The reality is that cancer cells not only feed from sugars, they could feed from proteins, or they could feed from fats. I wish it was that simple, that we stop all sugars and the cancer will die. No, then they start utilizing proteins. So, you stop sugar, you stop proteins.
Is the cancer going to say, “Oh, I'm going to die”? No, it gets its food from fats. So, you stop sugars, you stop proteins, and you stop fats, then the person succumbs because they're malnourished. So it's, it's a balance.
And the closer we are with nature, I guess that's another tip, the closer we are with nature and our food, I believe in my clinical experience of 30 plus years, the better outcome a patient would have.
And not let food or nutrition stress them, because then that's a problem, the stress. And there's something also called non-food nutritional factors. You could spend thousands of dollars eating at whole foods or getting all this organic food and all this, but what about if you're not moving?
What about if you're not getting enough sunshine? What about if you're not blessing your food? Praying over your food? All these things have positive mindset. If these don't go along with a healthy nutritional program, then even the best of foods are not going to have the maximum benefit for you. So, we have to look at all these details.
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, it feels like people who are coming to your clinic are not receiving the immediate treatment that they need to receive, but also a lifelong education and tips that they can bring home and will serve them well in the future as well as their family.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: That's correct. That's correct. And, oftentimes, when the patients come back for a three-month follow up after their initial three-week visit, or they come back in six months or a year, and they come back with their family member, whether it's the husband, the wife, the daughter, or the friend, they're like, “Oh! We feel a lot better, too, because we've been following what the patient did.”
So that's what we're here for, right, Sylvie and Victor and this Beljanski podcast is to educate, to inform, and to know that you can feel better. Sometimes we think we feel as good as we can, but not necessarily, right? Not necessarily. We can feel much better. So, we want to have healthspan and lifespan. We want to live longer, but good quality of life, and that's up to us. We can make that decision today.
Conclusion and Upcoming Events
Sylvie Beljanski: And you will continue to educate us in, in Austin, Texas, at the upcoming Beljanski Integrative Conference.
What is going to be, do you know already what's going to be the topic of your talk?
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Well, let's keep it as a surprise for all those that are coming to the Beljanski Conference in Austin, Texas in 2025. I highly encourage you to be there. It's a lot of education, not only myself, Sylvie and her team, and prominent doctors that she's inviting, and scientists.
Right? And the good thing about it is that we're not only backstage or in a room, sequestered, we're within the crowd. Remember, of course, Sylvie, last year, we're mingling with the crowd, we're talking, we're just sharing. It's such a beautiful event. Please share this information of the next Beljanski Conference in Austin, Texas in 2025.
Sylvie Beljanski: We don't know what's going to be the topic of your talk, but based on what you delivered last time, I think everybody will be in for a treat in next time.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Thank you. Thank you. But, we're in the trenches.
We're seeing patients every day. So, when we talk, it's not because of one person healing themselves, which I respect, we can learn a lot from that, we're seeing patients every day, different ages, different cancers, different mindsets, all of it, right? So, it's a lot of experience and, and that's what I want to bring forth in my participation at your conference, Sylvie.
Sylvie Beljanski: Yeah, it's pretty unique and so valuable. Thank you.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Yes, my pleasure and honor.
Victor Dwyer: Yeah, Dr. Tony, please tell the audience how to find more about you, find more about your book and everything like that.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: All right. Yes, I think that the first thing is to get this book. It's not about selling this book. It's about education.
Let me tell you a short story. We just have a patient, I think from Nebraska, and she has a very advanced breast cancer and she comes with a companion. No, sorry, from Canada. She comes with her companion, and in the consult, the companion says, “Dr. Tony, I never came here, but I bought your book when I was diagnosed with breast cancer. And I followed your book, everything you said there, and now I'm free of breast cancer. And I didn't receive any conventional therapy, and now I'm accompanying my friend to your center. And I am so happy to meet you, to meet your team, and to see in person what you do.” But all she did, not all she did, it's a lot, but what she did was she followed the guidelines here with The Seven Key Principles of Cancer Therapy.
So, I think this is like a little bible of integrative oncology, right? And the website, Victor, is www dot hope four, the number four, cancer dot com. Hope4cancer.com. And we have a team of doctors and admissions coordinators that will answer any questions.
Just go to the website and you could avail yourself to our contact information, but that's the best way to reach us, but buy the book and, and come to the Beljanski Conference next year.
Oh, you know what? I just realized that I'll have my emotions and cancer book at the conference. So, that will be, it will have just been launched a couple months before the conference, so that'll be exciting.
Sylvie Beljanski: So, I think I have a hint of what your conference is going to be about.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Emotions and nutrition are the talks that people always love the most because, not too many talk about that.
Sylvie Beljanski: Absolutely. Absolutely. Very much looking forward to it and thank you so much, Dr. Jimenez. Thank you so very much.
Dr. Antonio Jimenez, MD, ND: Thank you for having me.
Victor Dwyer: Yes. Thank you. And thank you everyone that got this far in the podcast. Thank you for listening. This is The Beljanski Cancer Talk Show and we'll catch you next time. Thank you.